FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Old-New Themes

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic     Forum Index -> CHARACTERS
View previous topic :: View next topic  

How does your story end?
Happily-Ever-After?
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Bitter-sweet, some good, some bad?
75%
 75%  [ 6 ]
They all die, and there's no rejoicing in MY kingdom!
12%
 12%  [ 1 ]
I've got an unusual ending (please describe)
12%
 12%  [ 1 ]
None of the above
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Parody of one of the above
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 8

Author Message
mornara
ADMINISTRATOR


Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 2891

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 7:35 pm    Post subject: Old-New Themes Reply with quote

When you go shelf-browsing in Borders or Barnes and Noble, or nearly any bookstore, there are certain themes that can get pretty repetitive and tiresome after a while. Most of my experience at a bookstore fantasy section recently can be summed up to "The brave hero, a poor farm boy at birth, must quest to save the world and his lady love from the forces of evil, facing scary things that were ripped off from some horror film, and then returns to marry the princess and rule his happy people with great honor."

There's a reason I don't look at most authors anymore, because there are very few who push the boundaries at all.

A theme you don't seem to see very often anymore though is tragedy, and unrequited love, or loss for no real reason at all. Fantasy have become so polished, and so tuned to Western thought, that the power of "not-happily-ever-after" seems to have been lost. I loved the "Memory, Thorn and Sorrow" series almost as much as any book I've read, until I came to the end. Wait, the hero was royalty? Well, there went THAT good book, I guess royalty really is the only "species" capable of heroic feats.

But what about a prince who loves a commoner, but she's sensible enough not to fall for his golden promises, or even just plain doesn't love him? And no matter what he does, it doesn't change her mind, isn't that a more realistic view? Or a Don Quixote, charging the windmills and riding to glory, but belittled and scorned in his quest for a life that's got a little of the glory of the old days? Or (is it Hero? No, one of the others, the title escapes me), a modern, Asian version of the classic stories, where the MC sets out to assassinate his father's murderer, and save his people, only to realize that the man needs to be spared. He sacrifices his own life instead, making a tale far more memorable and powerful than if he had succeeded and married his childhood sweetheart. Or a Shakespearan comedy, or tragedy, where things just never quite go right for the bumbling hero and his adorable, but just-not-right-in-the-head love interest?

These are tales that have so much potential for resurrection, and bringing new life to the genre. I think people are getting tired of the happily-ever-after, and ready for escapism that rings of reality. Lord of the Rings, one of the most popular books in the genre, was hardly "happily-ever-after" for anyone. "American Gods" ends a little sadly. So why aren't more young authors doing this?

Is anyone planning on a bitter-sweet ending for their story? Or does the hero succeed, marry his princess, and rule his kingdom happily ever after?

_________________
To run from misery’s thrall to where only the knife-edged thrill stands before the endless fall…

To allow for the existence of one god, we must allow for the existence of all gods.


Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FIFTHWIND
FLOUNDER? I 'ARDLY KNOW 'ER!


Joined: 18 Mar 2007
Posts: 3050
Location: Las Vegas

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most closely fits into your "bitter-sweet" category... though not much sweet.

There is a new page that MUST be turned, so perhaps the surviving characters might have a chance to find a silver lining.

I hate nicely packaged happy-endings, so I've gone with an unhappy one where there is a "sense of hope" for a chance of a brighter day. Keep in mind that this is a multi-book series, so ending the first on a good note isn't needed. Smile

Quote:
is tragedy, and unrequited love, or loss for no real reason at all.


Aren't you guys the same people who ate me alive for announcing I had done just that? Yes, the death scene I have is pointless, unexpected and serves no purpose other than to make thr reader say "WTF that ain't fair!"

_________________
<b>---Ken Kiser </b>

Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!

(My quest for publication)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Grammer
~Baker of Cookies & Souls~
~Baker of Cookies & Souls~


Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 1800
Location: Sure you wanna know?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you say there in the beginning is the reason I don't read too much fantasy at the moment. I can't find anything that's not studded with dragons and ending happily.

I prefer the bitter-sweet endings, so what I write will end on that.

_________________
The Knights of the Pink Slippers are now recruiting!

Cute: Anything that will kill unwanted visitors in a very nasty way.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Mokele
MODERATOR
MODERATOR


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 639
Location: Cincinnati

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I never do happily-ever-after, because it's just too cheesy. But I also never do "Rocks fall, everyone dies", because it's depressing and therefore doesn't fit with the humorous tone of my work. Instead, I tend to have a mix.

For instance, in my completed novel the heroes do wind up defeating the evil monster without any deaths in their numbers. Then one sub-group of them turns on their allies and brutally murders them, and it ends with one of the most powerful characters caving in to the addiction that will eventually consume them and turn them into the primary villain of the sequel.

Mokele

_________________
"With malleus aforethought, mammals got an earful of their ancestor's jaw" - J Burns, Biograffiti
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
WishingStar
MODERATOR
MODERATOR


Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 761

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have noticed in myself an odd fascination for writing death scenes from the point of view of the about-to-be-deceased. Sometimes this character is the protagonist, which I guess counts as bittersweet.

More often though, the type of ending I prefer is the hopeful one. There shouldn't be a complete happily-ever-after--I agree that's too pat and unrealistic--but ending on an uplifting note, where sure, there are mountains of trouble staring your characters in the face, but they've just won an incredibly difficult victory, they have a chance to catch their breaths, and they're all set to tackle the next problem head-on. But that is another story. Wink

(No, I'm not condoning the perpetual writing of rip-off sequels. I think you should absolutely give the impression that your character's lives go on beyond the page. I shall be most displeased if Disney tries to come out with a fourth Pirates of the Caribbean movie, for instance.)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Twoplus
Teller of Tales
Teller of Tales


Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 51

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm amused that all the poll answers are "bittersweet".

I guess there's been a trend in modern novels to go for realism more than the fairytale ending. Fantasy though seems to have missed out on this revolution. So many of the "next best" fantasy authors are writing drivel that I very rarely buy them new anymore. For example, Cecilia Dart Thornton, that Eragon rubbish, and I can't think of any more examples at the moment.

SF, urban fantasy and paranormal seem to have escaped this fate and are evolving and growing. My personal opinion is that fantasy fans are the most conservative of the group and therefore aren't keen on the breakaway novels. Fantasy now reads the same as fantasy 10 years ago, and that's very sad.

2+

_________________
"Every word on the page is one step closer to a chapter. Every finished chapter is one step closer to a book. Every finished book is one step closer to a dream.
Every dream is built one word at a time."

Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Elanor
Follower of the Path
Follower of the Path


Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 329
Location: Norway

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

*gasp* You didn't just bash Cecilia Darth Thornton?
I agree with the whole point that fairytale endings are unimaginative and exhausted.. But I don't think the Bitterbynde fell into that category. Confused
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Twoplus
Teller of Tales
Teller of Tales


Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 51

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I only made it through 2/3 of the first book, before her appalling characterisation and purple prose drove me up the wall. I'm sure she improved by the second and third in the trilogy, but she'd lost me by then. So no, not a CDT fan Smile

I wasn't meaning to group her into the "happy ending" category, more just "general drivel". Er. Forgive me for bashing an author you approve of - we all have different taste. But I was very disappointed in the book, and it's flavoured my attitude towards her writing.

2+

_________________
"Every word on the page is one step closer to a chapter. Every finished chapter is one step closer to a book. Every finished book is one step closer to a dream.
Every dream is built one word at a time."

Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Elanor
Follower of the Path
Follower of the Path


Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 329
Location: Norway

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's absolutely no need to apologize. Like you said, we have different taste. Smile

Quote:
her appalling characterisation and purple prose

Really? I'm almost inclined to read it again, to look for that. I must admit that it's a while since I read it, and I read simply for entertainment back then. *shudders* I hope I won't agree with you.

But the trilogy does pick up. I do think it is worth reading all three of the books, simply for the story, which I loved.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
doomhammr
MODERATOR
MODERATOR


Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 362
Location: Las Vegas

PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like everyone is siding with a realistic bittersweet one so far.

_________________
Wanna go the distance, with a hunger that never ends
When you want to prove, you're the best that's ever been
They can knock you down, you're on your feet again
'Cause you know what it takes, what it takes to win
-Journey "What it Takes to Win"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic     Forum Index -> CHARACTERS All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001 phpBB Group

Chronicles phpBB2 theme by Jakob Persson (http://www.eddingschronicles.com). Stone textures by Patty Herford.

Abuse - Report Abuse
Powered by forumup.org free forum, create your free forum!
Created by Raulken of Hyarbor S.r.l.
TOS & Privacy.

Page generation time: 0.099